Where to draw the line - banter vs bullying

Clive Holland tackles the contentious topic of bullying

In the latest episode of The Clive Holland Show, Clive Holland learns when banter goes too far and turns into bullying. He asks what oversteps the mark and how it can be prevented. 

Research shows that 21% of construction employees have experienced bullying in the past few years, and almost three in 10 claim bullying was labelled as 'banter'. 

Plumber Jimmy says that apprentices need to know they aren't at school anymore. "There's a fine line between banter and bullying, which can go far in various degrees. I know of one case where the plumbers were heating bolts on compression couplings where an apprentice was working. To me, that's bullying." 

He also adds that bullying has evolved beyond the workplace. It's gone online. Having said that, he hopes that banter doesn't leave the industry as it draws people out of their shells. 

Andy Cam, host of the Heating & Plumbing Show, reveals that he's been in the trade for 46 years, employed many tradespeople, and had six apprentices.

"One of the lads who had been my apprentice for four years once told me in the van on the way home that I made him feel like 'poo' on the job as he was always taking a loo break. I apologised and tried my best not to do it again." 

He further adds that some get offended too easily nowadays. "When we were young, we just took it on the chin and carried on." 

Paul Meenan, co-host of The Electrical Show, reveals that he was bullied as an apprentice, some of which was 'character-building'. 

"I gave our apprentices one per cent of the character-building part. Apprenticeship is about repeat, repeat, and pressure to mould skills." 

He argues that the worst bullying is from project managers who have no clue what they're doing. "Developers and high-rise builders are the worst, setting impossible targets and budgets." 

Clive also reads messages from listeners sent to the show. Listener Dean Harrison says, "Sending in the apprentice for a long wait or bump starting the discotheque is a tradition that will always gain a laugh as banter, but it's a step too far if someone gets an injury from a prank or mickey-taking gets personal." 

A message from J Bailey & Sons reads: "Life on site is very different today from when I first started. However, it's important to discuss this and tell anyone bullied to speak out and not be afraid."

Another listener, Steven, notes that being bullied was part of the apprenticeship in the 1980s. "It was not fun, but definitely character-building." 

A message from Magnum Opus Leadwork says: It's mostly hate speech and racism. One of our friends who was learning to become a plumber committed suicide out of the blue. It's got to stop, lads, or reap what you sow." 

Another listener notes that he was bullied as an apprentice by a subcontractor. "It was always passed off as banter. I was once locked in a metal toolbox and hit with a shovel when I gave it back. Banter will always be a part of being on site, but there's always someone who never knows where the line is." 

GMB Union rep Charlotte reveals that bullying is a "huge issue" and "pervasive" in the industry. "It is pretty indiscriminate, whether on a big, well-organised site or smaller satellite sites. If left unaddressed, it can have a long-lasting impact on tradespeople." 

She points out that there's a mental health crisis in industry and "people need to look after their colleagues and each other". 

She advises speaking out, whether it’s the person bullying you or the person in charge.

Listen to the podcast here.